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Give us more hard stuff!
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    viathyn
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by viathyn » Thu Jul 21, 2011 8:04 am

    mooyagi wrote:
    KDibildox wrote:
    Ktulured55 wrote: you may like them more as you are a Unicorn Humper.

    UNICORN HUMPER!!!!!!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:


    Hey don't knock it 'til you've tried it :lol: That was a good one by Ktulu :headbanger:

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    shaneos
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by shaneos » Thu Jul 21, 2011 9:42 am

    viathyn wrote:I put my clothes in a Unicorn Hamper.


    Next thing we'll find out is you're a Unicorn Camper: http://unicorncamps.com/

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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by Bentz! » Thu Jul 21, 2011 9:44 am

    Devils Advocate wrote:
    soundcurve wrote:Sorry, didn't mean to say it sounds like Domination, more like this would have been the next album in 98 if Dave never left. Either way, TEHO.

    KevinP wrote:If it wasn't the 1st album with Disco D back in the fold coupled with an 8 year wait, the reaction would have been far less severe.


    I guess that is it too. I don't believe they spent 8 years making the album from what I read. If people wanted brutal and more straight forward Morbid Angel it seems they'd be saying this album is shit compared to FFTF, Gateways, Heretic, etc. But instead I think people expect Altars / Blessed / maybe Covenant or maybe a lot of people lost touch with MA (Like me) during the tucker years. Even though I was a teen when Domination came out. I recall the older fans hating that album for some of the same reason I read about the dislike of the current album (Aside from radikult). I'll still hit up their show if they come through here, and even buy a Illud Divinum Insanus tour T-shirt :lol:


    I think you got that fairly much spot on - the expectations for this were probably too high. I wonder will the reactions to this cd influence their next recording?


    I agree that expectations were high, but I think most people, myself included, were expecting a Death Metal album, and not so much Rob Zombie / Rammstein style stuff.
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by viathyn » Thu Jul 21, 2011 9:45 am

    shaneos wrote:
    viathyn wrote:I put my clothes in a Unicorn Hamper.


    Next thing we'll find out is you're a Unicorn Camper: http://unicorncamps.com/


    I go to the spa when I want to get unicorn pampered.
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by WizardBeast » Thu Jul 21, 2011 11:21 am

    Bentz! wrote:
    I agree that expectations were high, but I think most people, myself included, were expecting a Death Metal album, and not so much Rob Zombie / Rammstein style stuff.


    i had no expectations for this record, AND i don't care about how long it took them, AND i like a wide variety of music including electronic-influenced metal like Samael, and i think this album SUCKS...the songs are boring as hell, period.
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by alex_canada » Thu Jul 21, 2011 11:52 am

    I'd like to see Ke$ha onboard. Good times.
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by soundcurve » Thu Jul 21, 2011 2:14 pm

    rhiawiz wrote:i had no expectations for this record, AND i don't care about how long it took them


    It doesn't seem you like them much to start with. I was still expecting this to sound like Morbid Angel which I think it does.

    Bentz! wrote:I agree that expectations were high, but I think most people, myself included, were expecting a Death Metal album, and not so much Rob Zombie / Rammstein style stuff.


    I would still call it a death metal album. You figure the big "WTF" is still Radikult, Destructos Vs The Earth, and to some Too Extreme!, aside from that most of it is fairly same old sounding MA /w Dave picking up from 96. Omitting Omni Potens as a intro

    Death Metal
    Too Extreme! (If you swapped out the 4/4 gabber drumming)
    Existo Vulgoré
    Blades For Baal
    I Am Morbid (Some may argue cock rock but I find it a cool anthem for them)
    10 More Dead
    Nevermore
    Beauty Meets Beast
    Profundis - Mea Culpa

    And the <fill in genre tracks>
    Destructos Vs The Earth
    Radikult

    I know you (Bentz!) and KevinP are more old school death metal dudes so if you feel it is crap it has more weight and wouldn't try to argue it really. My observation though is that most people that are given the power to write the reviews are by people who weren't even alive when David Vincent was in the band. I'd assume their definition / expectation of what death metal is would already be based on bands several generations influenced by MA or Tucker-era MA.

    Either way I will convince no one but use the album as it also seems to highlight over-reaction media can sway by simply writing it off due to 3 questionable songs. Unless the way people rate albums is either 1/10 or 10/10, to that I say . . . Too Extreme!!! :beerwink:

    I'll stop beating this horse as it seems to have derailed the thread.
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by BehnWilson » Thu Jul 21, 2011 4:29 pm

    I didnt read ANYTHING about the album before I listened to it so I formed my own opinion.

    I was in shock and couldnt believe it was a Morbid Angel album. I was almost laughing, like WTF is this? I was so disappointed as I was so psyched for this once I heard that David Vincent rejoined the band.
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by KevinP » Thu Jul 21, 2011 6:40 pm

    soundcurve wrote:I know you (Bentz!) and KevinP are more old school death metal dudes so if you feel it is crap it has more weight and wouldn't try to argue it really. My observation though is that most people that are given the power to write the reviews are by people who weren't even alive when David Vincent was in the band. I'd assume their definition / expectation of what death metal is would already be based on bands several generations influenced by MA or Tucker-era MA.


    I'm still somewhere in the middle with my opinion on this. I think it's going to take many months or a year or so for me to have a truly clear picture that isn't clouded with any bias or trying to play devil's advocate.

    I've definitely put waaaaaaay too much thought into this record than I would normally on a release, so might as well continue and blab to you about it. :lol:

    Prior to the release Vincent came back in like 2004/2005 and they toured so people were excited, even though he was wearing spandex pentagram shirts. :lol: Then almost a year prior to release we heard a live version of Nevermore. Sounded pretty good. Nothing ultra super insanely awesome, but good enough. At that moment I won't say I was freaking out good or bad, but that kinda framed my expectations. Trey was also up front well prior to release that the new album would have a hardcore techno aspect to it, but he claimed it was the real artistic stuff, not the dance house garbage. He even talked about trying to do a mini festival or something with a bunch of those types of artists.

    They release song titles, and that's when I started to get a little worried. After that they release Existo Vulgore. Again, in the Nevermore vein, but it's all speed and nothing "deep". Morbid Angel have always been a band that had a deep feeling and soul to their music and their lyrics as well, it wasn't just throw away stuff. I'm not a lyrics junkie, but still was nice that there was some depth and layers to what they were doing (in the past).

    Then the 90 second samples of all the songs hit and everyone freaked the fuck out. I kinda enjoyed it and liked a good chunk of it, even though it was different. I wanted to give it a chance and I definitely give the bands I like the "benefit of the doubt". And since there was such a uproar over it, I kinda liked defending it and still didn't think it was as close being that bad as people claimed.

    After finally listening to the album countless times I feel I have a pretty accurate impression on it.

    The death metal tunes range from good to decent. None of these songs reek of classic material or anything I'm overly wet & giggly about. I don't hate any of them. The only throwaway would be Beauty and the Beast, which is kinda boring. I would mind hearing the other ones lives as I've heard their typical setlist plenty of times over te years.

    I Am Morbid. I don't like chant, call to arms, anthem songs period. Yeah it's catchy and solo is pretty cool, but it still pains me to hear MA do these silly lyrics. I could never pump my fist and chant "Morbid" at a show and will likely get DOUCHECHILLS when it ever happens. :twisted:

    The techno songs. There are some interesting ideas buried in there. Layered guitar work and the fact that there is no drum machine and it's all live playing. But they could have crammed all the good parts into maybe 1 "good song" and it would feel far less intrusive. Mea Culpa I actually like the most as it's pretty twisted and has some crazy stuff going on. A good fusion of styles and feels more natural and less "out of left field".

    Radikult. This feels like total fan flame bait. I have no idea why they put this song on the record. They knew they were gonna get total shit for it, they ain't stupid enough to think people would eventually accept it. And the lyrics, by god, the lyrics. It's a fucking mockery of everything MA stands for. Again the solo/guitar break is pretty badass, but it's surrounded by a fucking travesty of a song. It's listenable in the sense that it's catchy and fun to laugh at in a weird way. People would riot if they played this live, so why bother ?

    Vocals. Vincent seems to be stuck in mid range which is okay, but he's too high in the mix and it feels like they are forcing him on the listener in an attempt to make it stand out. Guitars need to be a little higher as well. Drums are too triggered/sterile sounding. But this might have been exactly what they were aiming for as Trey is a nut with how specific he wants their sound and nothing happens by accident with him (or so it seems).

    Some people say "if you take Radikult off the record, then there really isn't anything to bitch about". But it's more than that. You add up alot of the minor to moderate things: production, lyrics, lack of soul/feel to death metal tunes, boring techno parts, Radikult shitting on everything MA stands for and I can see how it leaves a huge sour taste in people's mouth.

    This is easily the most memorable and "catchy" album they've done. Sure I don't want every band to just pump out standard album after album. But prior to this MA did change in a good and non pussified way. The same way a band like Alice in Chains did. It was still the same band without feeling they are mailing it in OR taking a drastic turn. It was the best way to thread the needle between both areas.

    If I had to give it a specific number, I'll go with a 6 or 6.5. There are things I like, but with MA you really do expect more. It's justified with a band of their pedigree. I have no problems with Trey trying to explore this style going forward ala Mea Culpa or even Too Extreme. But they need to clear out the boring parts, tighten it up and make it more fucked up and brutal sounding. It feels like he was almost holding back somehow. As much as I would love them to go back to a "classic" sound next time, I wouldn't want it to be due to fan pressure, I'd want something genuine and from their heart. But this album was from their heart, so be careful what you wish for I suppose :mrgreen:
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by mooyagi » Thu Jul 21, 2011 7:11 pm

    tl;dr :P
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by soundcurve » Thu Jul 21, 2011 7:33 pm

    Excellent write up KevinP. I am glad you touch on the solo stuff even in Radikult. I know a solo isn't going to ever carry a whole song but some of the little shreds trey adds are pretty cool. I am also with you on the rating. maybe a bit more generous with the 6.5/10 - 7/10 I also hope if they decide to write another album it isn't based on any sort of backlash from fans but they don't strike me as doing something like that. Hey, they put radikult on Illud Divinum Insanus knowing their fans would shit the bed. :lol:

    :cheers:
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by ShoreSlayer » Thu Jul 21, 2011 11:50 pm

    One of the more enjoyable and well thought out walls of text I've seen round these parts in some time Kevin! A nice shift from you compared to the usual one liners :lol: (although many of those crack me up as well)

    You should slow down and really type shit more often ;)
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by KevinP » Fri Jul 22, 2011 4:25 am

    ShoreSlayer wrote:One of the more enjoyable and well thought out walls of text I've seen round these parts in some time Kevin! A nice shift from you compared to the usual one liners :lol: (although many of those crack me up as well)

    You should slow down and really type shit more often ;)


    Thanks, but don't hold your breath :lol: :lol: :lol:
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by Bentz! » Fri Jul 22, 2011 5:50 am

    Well done, Kevin! I think you spent more time typing that post than I have spent listening to the album!
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by KevinP » Fri Jul 22, 2011 6:52 am

    Bentz! wrote:Well done, Kevin! I think you spent more time typing that post than I have spent listening to the album!


    because it don't sound like Jungle Rot :heavydrink:
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by Bentz! » Fri Jul 22, 2011 7:11 am

    KevinP wrote:
    Bentz! wrote:Well done, Kevin! I think you spent more time typing that post than I have spent listening to the album!


    because it don't sound like Jungle Rot :heavydrink:


    :cheers: :deathmetal:
    You're pimping them more than I am! Thanks! (Meredith thanks you as well since she loves them also... Johan from Amon Amarth and Dave from Jungle Rot are the only musicians she's hugged after shows.)

    Know what, if the new MA album sounded like Jungle Rot, I'd probably still say that it sucked. :lol:
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by MetalJunkie » Sat Jul 23, 2011 11:09 am

    Ok, Morbid Angel aside, have you yanks out there heard of this excellent Norwegian band:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9cBmmKPFvM

    They are without doubt the most powerful live band i have ever seen, and i´ve seen quite a lot of bands!

    They may not be full-blown metal, but they´re still metal as fuck!
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by mooyagi » Sat Jul 23, 2011 11:10 am

    MetalJunkie wrote:Ok, Morbid Angel aside, have you yanks out there heard of this excellent Norwegian band:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9cBmmKPFvM

    They are without doubt the most powerful live band i have ever seen, and i´ve seen quite a lot of bands!

    They may not be full-blown metal, but they´re still metal as fuck!


    I keep hearing about them and I keep wondering why. Not a fan
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by KevinP » Sat Jul 23, 2011 11:16 am

    mooyagi wrote:
    MetalJunkie wrote:Ok, Morbid Angel aside, have you yanks out there heard of this excellent Norwegian band:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9cBmmKPFvM

    They are without doubt the most powerful live band i have ever seen, and i´ve seen quite a lot of bands!

    They may not be full-blown metal, but they´re still metal as fuck!


    I keep hearing about them and I keep wondering why. Not a fan


    Will give it a listen (evventually) :mrgreen:
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by Metalwrath » Sat Jul 23, 2011 3:58 pm

    So all these rants aside most of us stil have the same conclusion.
    Morbid Angel are still a great band we'd like to see play but the new album is a complete and utter disgrace to their legacy.
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by KevinP » Sat Jul 23, 2011 4:11 pm

    Metalwrath wrote:So all these rants aside most of us stil have the same conclusion.
    Morbid Angel are still a great band we'd like to see play but the new album is a complete and utter disgrace to their legacy.


    Like you listen to Morbid Angel. :lol: :lol: :lol:
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by Metalwrath » Sat Jul 23, 2011 4:16 pm

    KevinP wrote:
    Metalwrath wrote:So all these rants aside most of us stil have the same conclusion.
    Morbid Angel are still a great band we'd like to see play but the new album is a complete and utter disgrace to their legacy.


    Like you listen to Morbid Angel. :lol: :lol: :lol:

    Says the harcore Death metal fan who went to see Nitro play :lol:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CiCUj0ow ... re=related
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by mooyagi » Sat Jul 23, 2011 4:27 pm

    Metalwrath wrote:
    KevinP wrote:
    Metalwrath wrote:So all these rants aside most of us stil have the same conclusion.
    Morbid Angel are still a great band we'd like to see play but the new album is a complete and utter disgrace to their legacy.


    Like you listen to Morbid Angel. :lol: :lol: :lol:

    Says the harcore Death metal fan who went to see Nitro play :lol:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CiCUj0ow ... re=related


    I hear tell he's been listening to Rhapsody of Fire lately too :shock:
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by KevinP » Sat Jul 23, 2011 4:29 pm

    Metalwrath wrote:
    KevinP wrote:
    Metalwrath wrote:So all these rants aside most of us stil have the same conclusion.
    Morbid Angel are still a great band we'd like to see play but the new album is a complete and utter disgrace to their legacy.


    Like you listen to Morbid Angel. :lol: :lol: :lol:

    Says the harcore Death metal fan who went to see Nitro play :lol:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CiCUj0ow ... re=related


    :shock: Wow, can't believe you remembered that. :lol: I was in 11th grade at the time and my parents didn't give me unlimited curfew, so I could only see a few songs before I had to leave. Then 1 year later they give me an unlimited curfew. What the fuck was up with that?!?!?! Fuckers kneecapped me on a few shows. Maybe they were doing it for my benefit (in hindsight). :lol: :lol: :lol:

    Same thing happened with Dangerous Toys and Steve Stevens and the Atomic Playboys show (my friend was a Billy Idol fan, I didn't care for them so much).

    Thankfully by the time time death metal was catching on and I got into that the reins were off and I did what I wanted.
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by Bentz! » Sun Jul 24, 2011 8:07 am

    MetalJunkie wrote:Ok, Morbid Angel aside, have you yanks out there heard of this excellent Norwegian band:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9cBmmKPFvM

    They are without doubt the most powerful live band i have ever seen, and i´ve seen quite a lot of bands!

    They may not be full-blown metal, but they´re still metal as fuck!


    I like these guys (Kvelertak) alot. I'd love to see them live someday.
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by Metalwrath » Mon Jul 25, 2011 7:28 am

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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by Devils Advocate » Mon Jul 25, 2011 11:46 am

    Metalwrath wrote:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lwLZVrKECcs


    The 'Hitler reaction' parody is pretty funny as well - and it makes a few valid points
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by viathyn » Mon Jul 25, 2011 12:18 pm

    Bentz! wrote:
    MetalJunkie wrote:Ok, Morbid Angel aside, have you yanks out there heard of this excellent Norwegian band:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L9cBmmKPFvM

    They are without doubt the most powerful live band i have ever seen, and i´ve seen quite a lot of bands!

    They may not be full-blown metal, but they´re still metal as fuck!


    I like these guys (Kvelertak) alot. I'd love to see them live someday.

    Absolutely!

    I've only been listening to these guys for about a month, but I definitely dig it.
    It's like... turbonegro meets immortal.

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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by Bentz! » Mon Jul 25, 2011 12:36 pm

    viathyn wrote:Black n' Roll?

    It's definitely not Djent.
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by viathyn » Mon Jul 25, 2011 12:41 pm

    Yes, that we can be sure of.
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by DrinkMoxie » Mon Jul 25, 2011 12:42 pm

    viathyn wrote:Black n' Roll?

    it'll never touch Death'n'roll
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by viathyn » Mon Jul 25, 2011 12:43 pm

    Is it wrong if I want to touch death'n'roll?
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by Metalwrath » Mon Jul 25, 2011 12:43 pm

    Black and roll is what the last few Satyricon albums were.
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by Ktulured55 » Thu Jul 28, 2011 5:04 pm

    No, Satyricon is Blackmetal with 'catchiness'... just because it is more instantly catchy, does not mean it's rock, it just means it is catchy which most bands (and most black metal bands at that) cannot do even if they try. Satyricon have a unique and mature sound that is untouched for what it is. Just because some people like random notes put together in a black metal style, does not mean it is good black metal. Though a lot of black metal fans try to call anything that is better than regular black metal and that a lot of people like: "NOT black metal", when in fact, it still is (it's just different in some way, more mature, and or catches more fans).
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by mooyagi » Thu Jul 28, 2011 6:02 pm

    Ktulured55 wrote:No, Satyricon is Blackmetal with 'catchiness'... just because it is more instantly catchy, does not mean it's rock, it just means it is catchy which most bands (and most black metal bands at that) cannot do even if they try. Satyricon have a unique and mature sound that is untouched for what it is. Just because some people like random notes put together in a black metal style, does not mean it is good black metal. Though a lot of black metal fans try to call anything that is better than regular black metal and that a lot of people like: "NOT black metal", when in fact, it still is (it's just different in some way, more mature, and or catches more fans).


    For me, they've lost a lot of what made them great. I still love Mother North and the whole Nemesis Divina album but they really suck now. I've tried listening to some new stuff and just can't get into it.
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by shaneos » Thu Jul 28, 2011 7:20 pm

    mooyagi wrote:
    Ktulured55 wrote:No, Satyricon is Blackmetal with 'catchiness'... just because it is more instantly catchy, does not mean it's rock, it just means it is catchy which most bands (and most black metal bands at that) cannot do even if they try. Satyricon have a unique and mature sound that is untouched for what it is. Just because some people like random notes put together in a black metal style, does not mean it is good black metal. Though a lot of black metal fans try to call anything that is better than regular black metal and that a lot of people like: "NOT black metal", when in fact, it still is (it's just different in some way, more mature, and or catches more fans).


    For me, they've lost a lot of what made them great. I still love Mother North and the whole Nemesis Divina album but they really suck now. I've tried listening to some new stuff and just can't get into it.


    Agree 100%. There are some songs I class as melodic black metal classics, Mother North being on that list (Kings of Carnival Creation by Dimmu is another that springs to mind).
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by WizardBeast » Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:23 pm

    mooyagi wrote:
    Ktulured55 wrote:No, Satyricon is Blackmetal with 'catchiness'... just because it is more instantly catchy, does not mean it's rock, it just means it is catchy which most bands (and most black metal bands at that) cannot do even if they try. Satyricon have a unique and mature sound that is untouched for what it is. Just because some people like random notes put together in a black metal style, does not mean it is good black metal. Though a lot of black metal fans try to call anything that is better than regular black metal and that a lot of people like: "NOT black metal", when in fact, it still is (it's just different in some way, more mature, and or catches more fans).


    For me, they've lost a lot of what made them great. I still love Mother North and the whole Nemesis Divina album but they really suck now. I've tried listening to some new stuff and just can't get into it.


    for some reason i enjoy all eras of Satyricon! i also enjoy all eras of Enslaved and all eras of Samael. i'm weird like that. :ugeek:
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by Malaka » Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:16 pm

    rhiawiz wrote:for some reason i enjoy all eras of Satyricon! i also enjoy all eras of Enslaved and all eras of Samael. i'm weird like that. :ugeek:

    :cheers:
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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by WizardBeast » Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:17 pm

    SlaytanicE21 wrote:
    rhiawiz wrote:for some reason i enjoy all eras of Satyricon! i also enjoy all eras of Enslaved and all eras of Samael. i'm weird like that. :ugeek:

    :cheers:


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    Re: Give us more hard stuff!

    by Ktulured55 » Fri Jul 29, 2011 10:11 pm

    rhiawiz wrote:
    mooyagi wrote:
    Ktulured55 wrote:No, Satyricon is Blackmetal with 'catchiness'... just because it is more instantly catchy, does not mean it's rock, it just means it is catchy which most bands (and most black metal bands at that) cannot do even if they try. Satyricon have a unique and mature sound that is untouched for what it is. Just because some people like random notes put together in a black metal style, does not mean it is good black metal. Though a lot of black metal fans try to call anything that is better than regular black metal and that a lot of people like: "NOT black metal", when in fact, it still is (it's just different in some way, more mature, and or catches more fans).


    For me, they've lost a lot of what made them great. I still love Mother North and the whole Nemesis Divina album but they really suck now. I've tried listening to some new stuff and just can't get into it.


    for some reason i enjoy all eras of Satyricon! i also enjoy all eras of Enslaved and all eras of Samael. i'm weird like that. :ugeek:



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