[feanorfelagund]

Hi guys first timer here with a burning question...

What is the state of play regarding pits? I don't wanna find out that there is no moshing going down for some of my favourite bands, but I also don't wanna be the guy moshing alone in a sea of 'appreciators' who will end up hating me.

Don't get me wrong, I respect the watchers and the nodders etc. I totally get that not everyone wants to be rumbled while they are trying to soak in the awesomeness. But please tell me the cuise-goers get a good 20+ people pit for most artists. Also how are the security with this sorta thing? I don't imagine cruise staff are familiar with friendly violence.

(On a side note I have a theory that pits are slightly (only slightly) too violent. A lot more fun can be had in a pit if you grab people by the shoulders jump with them for a while and swing around until the centrifugal force blasts you into a new mosher with whome you repeat the process. You get less violent jarring impacts, less falls and like.. triple the awesome momentum insanity that for me is what a pit is about. Particularly good for folk metal. Anyone with me on this?)

Love Dan,
Pit Lifeguard

[cowboy71]

Walls of death, circle pits, crowd surfing. It all happens on broad :)

Security dont really seem to worry much at all about the moshing, but the most recent cruise they were incredibly over-zealous and harsh in their treatment of crowd surfers.

[mooyagi]

Depends on how the crowd feels, really. In general the pits are pretty small due to the crowds being pretty small but sometimes quite a few people can get going. Sometimes nobody is interested in getting rowdy. Depends on how much sun/booze/sleep/food everyone has had. Also the time of day. The pool deck can also get mighty slippery if we hit some wet weather.

[Feanorgandalf]

Where else will you see a chair mosh pit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=InEWzHo0Mpk

It was on Barge to Hell but still part of UMC and a lot of veterans of that one on these forums.

[ShoreSlayer]

Here's a couple threads you might enjoy...

http://www.70000tons.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=297&p=6295#p6295

http://www.70000tons.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=51

[klons]

Anybody have a video of Finntroll's theater set from last year? That was insanity

[Memnoch]

I think the security was right in trying to stop the crowd surfing, even if there were a few incidents where things could've been handled better. In my opinion, crowd surfing is ok on an open air festival with a big crowd. You should never do it in a small club, which even the pool stage is.

[bodomdragon]

I think the security was right in trying to stop the crowd surfing, even if there were a few incidents where things could've been handled better. In my opinion, crowd surfing is ok on an open air festival with a big crowd. You should never do it in a small club, which even the pool stage is.

The way they treated crowd surfers was not only sexist, absurd and disrispectful but also extremely dangerous. They treated the girl crowd surfers as they always should - that is, pick them up when they reach the front and let them go - but when it came to guys, I just wanted to punch those security guards in the face after seeing how they acted. You CANNOT push crowd surfers back into the crowd. That's fucking dangerous and makes no sense at all. I hope Andy learnt the lesson and has a word with them.

[Memnoch]

Yes, I too saw a couple of instances where they were being too rough, but I also saw people crowd surfing in the Spectrum, which is not only retarded but also dangerous. And when you have a crowd of, say, fifty people, crowd surfing is stupid.

I see only two ways this could be handled:
a) ban crowd surfing completely
or
b) move the security barrier five to ten meters further from the stage than on previous cruises

"a" will anger some people, "b" will anger everyone.
The thing that people don't seem to understand is that there's not enough space between the barrier and the stage on the boat, and letting people crowd surf is a hazard to the surfers and to the security guys who have no space to move when trying to catch the surfers. Guess that's an American thing though, since I never see people crowd surfing on club gigs in Europe. On open air festivals, yes, but like I wrote earlier, that's a completely different situation.

[SaraMarie]

I've always hated mosh pits. What typically happens is I go to a metal show and try to stand out of the way while keeping an eye out for a pit, because it's happened too many times that some big douchebag shoves another big fat piece of shit into me when I wasn't suspecting. And then what happens is, once the pit forms, I have to go stand in the back and not see anything. I will say, though, it depends on the band's fans, the ones attracting core kiddies are obviously the worst.

Here in Europe, it's kind of refreshing that I haven't seen violent pits. Just guys kind of bouncing into each other and running in cirlces. No shoving or windmill guys. I suspect these kinds of "friendly" pits are probably what's typical on the boat. That I wouldn't hate.

Where else will you see a chair mosh pit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=InEWzHo0Mpk

It was on Barge to Hell but still part of UMC and a lot of veterans of that one on these forums.

Definitely not what I expected when clicking on the link! Nice! What is that, the laziest pit ever?

Guess that's an American thing though, since I never see people crowd surfing on club gigs in Europe.

[ANTIKRISS]

Where else will you see a chair mosh pit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=InEWzHo0Mpk

It was on Barge to Hell but still part of UMC and a lot of veterans of that one on these forums.

This. Is. Fucking. Awesome.!!!

[feanorfelagund]

Wow thanks so much for all the replies! I had searched around but could only find the one about chair mosh pit and horror stories. IMO too little about mosh pit success stories.

http://www.70000tons.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=297&p=6295#p6295

^yeh this was the one. Thanks and sorry (how British).

Not crowd surfing is probably a good idea.. As far as the pits go, I think it odd that there seems to be only one prevalent style of pit, which seems to only involve running round hitting people (exodus - toxic waltz style XD) best suited to thrash and punk. I think different genres of metal deserve different pit styles. And there is no reason why there can't be pits that the average person is not 'afraid' of (i.e. worried about being hit in the face while trying to appreciate the song). If we mosh 'with' people instead of 'into' people, I think more people would get involved and less people would get hurt.

The purpose is to move around a lot, to exert yourself and feel that ever-so-slight loss of control all to the sound of your favourite band, who are also going crazy by playing.. And when it's over you know that you, the people around you and even the band (who are also drained) shared that experience. You survived! The feeling I can only describe as exultant. Exultant and thirsty

Perhaps I'm rambling or stating the obvious, I'm no concert veteran. But it is something I feel quite passionately about.

[mooyagi]

Nothing like enjoying a show and getting a random foot to the back of the head. Fuck crowd surfing.

[Sgt. B]

Nothing like enjoying a show and getting a random foot to the back of the head. Fuck crowd surfing.

Sorry about that.

[deathmetalpat]

Yes, I too saw a couple of instances where they were being too rough, but I also saw people crowd surfing in the Spectrum, which is not only retarded but also dangerous. And when you have a crowd of, say, fifty people, crowd surfing is stupid.

I see only two ways this could be handled:
a) ban crowd surfing completely
or
b) move the security barrier five to ten meters further from the stage than on previous cruises

"a" will anger some people, "b" will anger everyone.
The thing that people don't seem to understand is that there's not enough space between the barrier and the stage on the boat, and letting people crowd surf is a hazard to the surfers and to the security guys who have no space to move when trying to catch the surfers. Guess that's an American thing though, since I never see people crowd surfing on club gigs in Europe. On open air festivals, yes, but like I wrote earlier, that's a completely different situation.

I am in total agreement with you about banning Crowd Surfing,everything is fine ;I was in The Wall of Death for Arkona Pool stage show and that was fine.But the surfing just isn't safe nor done the right way.Also there is some out of place stuff going on,moshing to a band that you don't expect to see moshing at.I know many people that like many types of music are on the cruise but when you get close to a band and some idiot just starts thrashing around cause he is drunk and the only one doing it,that is not cool.

[alex_canada]

The moshing on 70k is gentle, I haven't had any issues with it. You can usually get a vibe when crowdsurfers will be coming anyway, except that time when Hector did it during the odyssey

[ANTIKRISS]

Nothing like enjoying a show and getting a random foot to the back of the head. Fuck crowd surfing.

I agree.

I always bring them down when I have the chance

[viathyn]

I certainly don't want to see any crowdsurfers get hurt....
With that being said, I'm certainly not going to lift you up, I'm certainly not going to HOLD you up, and I'm certainly going to do my best to get you to the ground if you kick me in the head. Or I'll just stare daggers at you from afar. Fuck crowdsurfing.



Mosh pits that are organic and natural for the feel and the crowd are a-ok with me!


A mosher on the second cruise started slamming into a bunch of stationary people during a really chill amorphis song, so I may or may not have put him on the floor, lovingly.

[X-Thor]

The moshing on 70k is gentle, I haven't had any issues with it. You can usually get a vibe when crowdsurfers will be coming anyway, except that time when Hector did it during the odyssey

Twice.

[Lala]

Fuck crowd surfing.

and fuck moshpits too. i missed i.e. nearly the complete Gloryhammer Spectrum Gig cos every second Second someone knocked in my Back. why can't these People mosh where no one else is and they do not disturb that People who want to see a concert. go moshing at the Basketball court.....

[feanorfelagund]

and fuck moshpits too. i missed i.e. nearly the complete Gloryhammer Spectrum Gig cos every second Second someone knocked in my Back. why can't these People mosh where no one else is and they do not disturb that People who want to see a concert. go moshing at the Basketball court.....

I disagree, even large mosh pits I've been in account for maybe 10% of the crowd. There's room for all people to appreciate the music in their own way. Personally I find it weird that people want to just stand there with no compulsion to let loose, but to each his own.

[D.T. Metal]

IF moshing is done right there should be no issue. Start the pit about 5+ rows back (depending on the size of the venue and how many people are there) and leave the folks who are close to the barrier alone. BUT, the moshing mentality of some are "let's try to hit everyone who is in attendance" and therefore I get the points brought up here. A lost of American's also employ this karate chopping bullshit and one has to be afraid to be hit in the face with their swinging arms.

On a side note: THE BEST EVER pit I saw was this year at MDF when Ratos de Porão (old ass cross-over band from Brazil) played. They had a honest to god circle pit and in the middle were folks standing watching the show; unharmed.

[CountArioch]

All my metal concerts have all been folk/pagan metal concerts, and the moshing there tends to be tame (mostly guys roughhousing a bit, picking each else up when they trip, etc.). Something I don't do so much anymore, I tend to hang out near the booze supply (I've found that's the safest place to be if you don't want to roughhouse).

Some drunk kids started a mosh pit at a Jethro Tull concert I was at, that was kind of funny actually.

[Steve110]

Nothing like enjoying a show and getting a random foot to the back of the head. Fuck crowd surfing.

I must be the only one who doesn't mind this. I love the chaos. Also I don't how about other years since I went in 2012, but the floors tended to be reeeeal slippery especially on the pool deck which wasn't great for moshing. I'm not sure what they could do about that though.

[mooyagi]

Nothing like enjoying a show and getting a random foot to the back of the head. Fuck crowd surfing.

I must be the only one who doesn't mind this. I love the chaos. Also I don't how about other years since I went in 2012, but the floors tended to be reeeeal slippery especially on the pool deck which wasn't great for moshing. I'm not sure what they could do about that though.

Pool deck has been slippery and Chorus Line has been sticky.

[DJ Old Man Stares]

Fuck crowd surfing? Fuck moshing? Since when was metal meant to be clean and orderly? It's a chaotic atmosphere in general so chaotic things will happen. To answer the original question, I personally never found any of the pits or walls of death particularly violent. For the most part, it's a love fest. Its nothing like a Slayer pit where people are actually swinging punches. You don't like moshing? Cool, there's plenty of room to just stand in the back.

[EpidemicReign]

Fuck crowd surfing? Fuck moshing? Since when was metal meant to be clean and orderly? It's a chaotic atmosphere in general so chaotic things will happen. To answer the original question, I personally never found any of the pits or walls of death particularly violent. For the most part, it's a love fest. Its nothing like a Slayer pit where people are actually swinging punches. You don't like moshing? Cool, there's plenty of room to just stand in the back.

Pretty much how I feel. I'm not much of a mosher, at least not anymore, and I've never crowdsurfed and never care to. I prefer to sip a beer and bang my head and/or sing along to the band. But moshing is an integral part of the culture of metal, and I'm all for it even though I rarely partake anymore.

[CountArioch]

I wish I could crowdsurf, but men of my girth aren't really able to... Nor can we stage-dive (ever hear of the "flying moses"?)

[meshuggah]

I stay away from the moshers. Do they actually hear what the bands are playing...or does only the brutality register? If I'm concerned with getting slammed into, or wondering when the next karate idiot is going to plant a foot in my ribs, there's no way I can really appreciate the music the bands are playing. I love the energy, I love to move around to the music...but I also want to listen and understand how the bands put their songs together. A lot of the musical craftsmanship in metal is amazing...metal is truly the present day cutting-edge musical avant garde the way Stravinsky was in the 1900's.

[218]

I love how you can tell where people are from, just by their take:

Americans: "MOST BRUTAL THING IS TO MOSH. CANNOT STOP, IF YOU DO YOUR A PUSSY! FUCK WATCHING ANYTHING, I CAN WATCH LIVE VIDEOS ON YOUTUBE"

Everyone else: "I don't get it, some people are just stupid"

[mooyagi]

I love how you can tell where people are from, just by their take:

Americans: "MOST BRUTAL THING IS TO MOSH. CANNOT STOP, IF YOU DO YOUR A PUSSY! FUCK WATCHING ANYTHING, I CAN WATCH LIVE VIDEOS ON YOUTUBE"

Everyone else: "I don't get it, some people are just stupid"

Nope

[X-Thor]

I love how you can tell where people are from, just by their take:

Americans: "MOST BRUTAL THING IS TO MOSH. CANNOT STOP, IF YOU DO YOUR A PUSSY! FUCK WATCHING ANYTHING, I CAN WATCH LIVE VIDEOS ON YOUTUBE"

Everyone else: "I don't get it, some people are just stupid"

I'm pretty sure you can tell where people are from just by looking under our photo.

That being said I don't think anyone on this forum has said that if you don't mosh "your a pussy΅. And since this thread was started by someone from the UK, I would say the reaction by "everyone else" is also wrong.

[CountArioch]

Not everyone has their location under their pic (I generally don't, although I haven't really been keeping it a secret either). Moshing is part of the culture, but I don't think the people who aren't into moshing aren't automatically not from America (I wonder where the hell that puts me coming from...)

[feanorfelagund]

This guy has a point:

Fuck crowd surfing? Fuck moshing? Since when was metal meant to be clean and orderly? It's a chaotic atmosphere in general so chaotic things will happen. To answer the original question, I personally never found any of the pits or walls of death particularly violent. For the most part, it's a love fest. Its nothing like a Slayer pit where people are actually swinging punches. You don't like moshing? Cool, there's plenty of room to just stand in the back.

This guy is bang on:

IF moshing is done right there should be no issue. Start the pit about 5+ rows back (depending on the size of the venue and how many people are there) and leave the folks who are close to the barrier alone. BUT, the moshing mentality of some are "let's try to hit everyone who is in attendance" and therefore I get the points brought up here. A lost of American's also employ this karate chopping bullshit and one has to be afraid to be hit in the face with their swinging arms.

Karate chopping? Seriously? I've seen the types who just want to mosh and are not there for the music. You can tell when a ballad comes on and they keep going. These people are idiots and I doubt they will be found on the cruise due to the price (guessing). I'm more into the:

Just guys kind of bouncing into each other and running in cirlces. No shoving or windmill guys.

I just wanna know I can get my jig on to Ensiferum and Korpiklaani. And probably dance around like a pirate twat when Alestorm is on. Blind Guardian is a great example of an awesome band not to mosh to, different artists suit different crowds. I bet most people prefer to see a crowd go wild to an awesome band than a bunch of people standing still with their phones out (including people standing still with their phones out!). Those of you who enjoy the chaos but don't 'partake'. You are the guys needed on the edge to border the chaos.

If Finntroll are there though, all bets are off. It's Jaktens Tid

[Stained Class]

Yeah I have pretty much the same mentality as you. I'm usually on the edge of the moshpit cus I can see the best and I get to enjoy the mosh pit a little but also watch the band and I have room for headbanging when the pit calms down or moves away. Sometimes when there's a really high energy thrashy band I'll get right in the pit but the only bands that really make me want to mosh are the likes of Death Angel, Kreator, At The Gates, etc.

[Warphine]

As long as you don't have to deal with any really drunk sweaty dudes in their tighty-whities, the moshing is fairly standard.

What a story that was! LOL

[Stained Class]

As long as you don't have to deal with any really drunk sweaty dudes in their tighty-whities, the moshing is fairly standard.

What a story that was! LOL

That was on barge right? That was pretty funny.

[Warphine]

As long as you don't have to deal with any really drunk sweaty dudes in their tighty-whities, the moshing is fairly standard.

What a story that was! LOL

That was on barge right? That was pretty funny.

Yup! The dude had to be on drugs or something mind altering. Or he's just a dick. That's a possibly too.

[klons]

As long as you don't have to deal with any really drunk sweaty dudes in their tighty-whities, the moshing is fairly standard.

What a story that was! LOL

That was on barge right? That was pretty funny.

Yup! The dude had to be on drugs or something mind altering. Or he's just a dick. That's a possibly too.

Was it Calvin? Cause that sounds completely like something he would do. I've been curious if last year was his first time on broad or not, don't remember seeing him in 2013.

[Stained Class]

Was it Calvin? Cause that sounds completely like something he would do. I've been curious if last year was his first time on broad or not, don't remember seeing him in 2013.

No this dude had no hair on him.